Jason_SAKE Today at 3:20 AM EST every class is different 6 Jason_SAKE Today at 3:19 AM EST Could FAN have a chance..? 33 Jason_SAKE Today at 3:17 AM EST Vac banned for idle program 141 Jason_SAKE Today at 3:09 AM EST
Problem is that some invite teams are invited based on their new roster, not as their success as a team in previous seasons (only using individual acclaim). Unfortunately, due to the lack of static top tier teams, you either have a small league or you invite teams that have a high risk of dying :s
Then maybe having an invite division is the wrong way to go with it? What about just going with the open/main divisions for a season, let actual teams develop chemistry, and if it fails it not such a major impact to the division with the amount of teams. Usually I wouldn't think of it but when you have such a small amount of teams in a division it really hurts its success when you have so few teams actually playing.
But then again, next season will probably have some teams move up from open so it may not even be an issue. Although right now its fucked =/
I don't think the invite should be dropped, regardless. It's not fun for the invite teams to be forced to play lower caliber teams, and most lower caliber teams don't want to / are afraid of playing the better teams (see UGC stacked thread).
whoa i don't remember making this post, but now that i think of it with push out and FUyanks making rare appearances it seems as tho there will be even more FFW to come
teams die every season, thats why you need more than just 8 teams in invite, especially playing twice a week...the competition gets boring playing the same teams especially with teams like Push having to play the best teams every week, probably pretty frustrating to them
moral of the story: be nice to all new tf2 players so that more teams can be formed, thus increasing the volume of competition and making things less monotonous.
I don't see how having more teams in invite would solve the problem of dying teams, in fact having less teams sort of helps counter the problem. What they need to do is move teams up as invite teams die, and not to schedule dead teams for matches.
I can't believe the euro pug team died, what a shocker! I really expected them to stick out the whole season playing at 5am as a pug in a league they probably didn't care anything about.
ESEA TF2 subscriptions have been steadily growing since we launched, so I wouldn't say it is dying. Obviously I am personally very dissapointed at the number of forfeits this season and lack of commitment from many of the invite division players, but it isn't shocking considering how new TF2 is as a competitive title.
The invite division for us is a way to showcase the top talent to fans and give serious teams an outlet to compete at the highest level for cash. We will continue to seek the most skilled and most stable organizations and have some ideas to help ensure some stability across TF2 invite as the community develops. That being said we will not blindly and foolishly throw money or events at a community that isn't ready for it, so at this rate it will just take us longer to add elements like LAN playoffs and larger cash prizes.
As we've said from day 1 of ESEA TF2, it is going to be a collaborative process with the community and this week we're having a meeting with the remaining invite teams to kind of regroup and we'll likely do so with the open teams in the coming weeks as well as we start to internally ramp up for Season 4.
I must say, I was pretty dissapointed the last few nights when I would connect to the SCTV for a scheduled match and nothing would happen for an hour. This happened for every ESEA-i match. The most exciting match was the coL match where 4 coL member connected and backstabbed eachother a few times.
I said this in the other thread, it's hard for me to hate on ESEA for all that it has done for competitive gaming. I have been a member pretty much from the start and they never did anything bad. The CS league is currently the best league in the country in my opinion.
TF2 is a new game and I am sure they will get their stuff figured out. Stop being babies.
And it would be nice if the ESEA-i teams played they're scheduled matches.
unless a bunch of new invite-ready teams pop up out of nowhere, i can't really see why esea would want to have another invite division next season. imo make a main division and move all the invite teams and top 5 open teams from this season into it. the open teams might not do all that well against the very best but speaking as a player who has a chance of being top 5 in open i'd rather have complexity 4 times in my schedule than a bunch of dead or horrible teams.
Fuyanks, ok, virgin police, ok, but what the heck is the deal with Push? They defeated EG (albeit with some roster problems), why would they just give up?
This was supposed to be a kicka$$ season, it just crumbled apart
And let's not forget about ESEA-O, which is arguably worse
I like daniel's idea, but I doubt those teams being moved up like it (cause they have the best shot at $, and they'll get raped for a while at least). Col, pandy, 20id, pure, mob, eg are the only certain esea invite quality teams.
Given the shakeups that happened between the end of ESEA S2/CEVO S3 and the start of ESEA S3, I think it's a bit premature to talk about whether another season of ESEA-I is viable. A lot of people talk about ESEA being the "last hope" for competitive TF2 ... and Torbull sounds pretty confident, so that itself should be reason to believe that ESEA.TF2 still has a chance to blow up.
#40 If players are willing to pay $20 for entry into other league with $1,800 prize pots in other leagues then they shouldn't be whining because they have to pay $20 - $26 for entry into a league with a $6,770 cash prize pool after THEY blew the opportunity to only have to pay $8. We notified team captains in early May of a 50 hour minimum per TEAM (not player) in our pug system to help stimulate the ESEA pug activity in order to maintain free Premium. The vast majority of teams made NO attempt to get any hours (most had less than 5), so we deactivated their free Premiums as we told them we would do.
esea has some serious issues. We have some people on tight schedules. Scheduling a match and not being able to play it because they have to patch their client manually at every tf2 update and don't do so immediately is bordering on unacceptable.
maybe people should stop bailing on their teams and stick it out. the biggest problem isn't the league its the players. everybody wants to be on the best team. it doesn't work like that. look at all the teams that are at the top of the league, they have all made at least 2 roster changes outside of eg i think.
stick with your team and build chemistry and you will get there simple as that. i would also put some of the blame on the organizations themselves. they need to be more involved with their teams to make sure ffl don't happen. i know when we go to pick up teams one of the 0nly things i won't tolerate is a ffl.
I still think it was a mistake to invite FUYANKS, despite the obvious talent they had. An invite league shouldnt invite a brand new team, specifically one everyone knew would have problems scheduling matches. Im not sore over us getting the boot because of it, we would have had trouble winning a match, and the FUYANKS lineup was impressive, but I know we would have been there for every match, and I know it was pretty obvious scheduling issues would occur. But its not just their fault, at least euros have an excuse as to why matches arent getting scheduled, which is more then some teams over here can say.
Like 20 said, need more than 8 teams in invite.
also, I agree with 37, a main division might be best for next season, group together a general pool of talent and see where that leads for a potential I division for the 3rd season...assuming we arent all customizing our headgear shoulderpads and shirt patches for level ups
#42 That is simply not true. I can have litany send you the chat logs if you like. We can also talk about how we have given you feedback on your pug system and afaik not a single issue has been addressed in months.
#43 it takes time to do the updates. If it didn't need to be done or could be done automatically we would, hehe...
#46 we listen to what you have to say but it doesn't always mean we jump and get it done it done right away. We have limited resources and things need be prioritized and while TF2 is important, we also have other things in the pipeline that we need to dedicate time and people to. I don't remember your suggestions off hand, but just because someone suggests something doesn't mean it is in the best interest of the community to do or get done right away.
We all have tons and tons of ideas to improve things, but we simply have to prioritize what is important and I feel very strongly that our product as-is is ready for prime time but there certainly are improvements that can and should be made over time.
Never heard anything about puging 50 hours a week when I signed us up. How could they ever expect us to achieve that? Further more, the ESEA client was probably the worst third third-party client I've used in gaming. Both us and EG were ready and willing to play our game but the client didn't let us start. It crashed during our coL game and made us all disconnect from the server. Log-in issues almost every time someone tried to start it up. One time a game an admin had rescheduled to a day BEFORE intead of an hour later, suddenly popped up out of no where and said we had to join the server so we wouldn't recieve a default loss.
Oh well, paying the league fee to play half a season... Won't ever fall for that scam again :).
With that said, ehFk has been incredibly helpful towards us during our stay here in ESEA. Too bad the higher up admins wasn't able to help with a simple task as rescheduling a game. Thank you, ehFk. Enjoy your league fee money, ESEA.
It seems to me that based off the sheer number of threads and issues I've seen both in gotfrag and from ESEA matches directly that there is some fundamental issue at hand here. I don't think it's really simple to just point a finger and start giving orders for a quick fix, but certainly something is wrapped up badly enough that it does need some obvious changing. I won't go into the specific things I've seen (as well as others) that obviously failed hard, because chances are they've been reported already.
It's a pretty bad strategy to try to appeal to a new competitive community in a fairly new game when you've gained the image of a broken system. One of the things I've heared from ESEA is that they're better for reasons such as their prize pot in comparison to CEVO. However, if there is a flood of issues and complaints dealing with the system at hand despite the fact that the prize pot is exceptionally better, then that tells me there is a conflict of interest when it comes to priorities. That's not a good thing when you're trying to grow.
And although you might see an increase in subscriptions, I don't even have to mention the increase in forfeits, drops, and general whining and complaining. I can't attribute all of those things towards ESEA itself of course, but I'd be more than willing to assume that if things ran a little better than people would be less inclined to submit to those types of things.
!-- Begin comScore Tag -->
Is Esea I dying
And then invite more steady rosters for next season.
What are you talking about is this league struggling
Jason_SAKE
Today at 3:20 AM EST
every class is different 6
Jason_SAKE
Today at 3:19 AM EST
Could FAN have a chance..? 33
Jason_SAKE
Today at 3:17 AM EST
Vac banned for idle program 141
Jason_SAKE
Today at 3:09 AM EST
nerd
Sure, Esea did blunder on the premium issue, but the real problem here is quite obvious, its the teams not the leagues with the problems.
But then again, next season will probably have some teams move up from open so it may not even be an issue. Although right now its fucked =/
I don't think the invite should be dropped, regardless. It's not fun for the invite teams to be forced to play lower caliber teams, and most lower caliber teams don't want to / are afraid of playing the better teams (see UGC stacked thread).
The invite division for us is a way to showcase the top talent to fans and give serious teams an outlet to compete at the highest level for cash. We will continue to seek the most skilled and most stable organizations and have some ideas to help ensure some stability across TF2 invite as the community develops. That being said we will not blindly and foolishly throw money or events at a community that isn't ready for it, so at this rate it will just take us longer to add elements like LAN playoffs and larger cash prizes.
As we've said from day 1 of ESEA TF2, it is going to be a collaborative process with the community and this week we're having a meeting with the remaining invite teams to kind of regroup and we'll likely do so with the open teams in the coming weeks as well as we start to internally ramp up for Season 4.
I must say, I was pretty dissapointed the last few nights when I would connect to the SCTV for a scheduled match and nothing would happen for an hour. This happened for every ESEA-i match. The most exciting match was the coL match where 4 coL member connected and backstabbed eachother a few times.
I said this in the other thread, it's hard for me to hate on ESEA for all that it has done for competitive gaming. I have been a member pretty much from the start and they never did anything bad. The CS league is currently the best league in the country in my opinion.
TF2 is a new game and I am sure they will get their stuff figured out. Stop being babies.
And it would be nice if the ESEA-i teams played they're scheduled matches.
cal main
cevo p s2
cevo p s3
esea i s2
same with cevo-p s3 but to a lesser degree
This was supposed to be a kicka$$ season, it just crumbled apart
And let's not forget about ESEA-O, which is arguably worse
I like daniel's idea, but I doubt those teams being moved up like it (cause they have the best shot at $, and they'll get raped for a while at least). Col, pandy, 20id, pure, mob, eg are the only certain esea invite quality teams.
stick with your team and build chemistry and you will get there simple as that. i would also put some of the blame on the organizations themselves. they need to be more involved with their teams to make sure ffl don't happen. i know when we go to pick up teams one of the 0nly things i won't tolerate is a ffl.
I still think it was a mistake to invite FUYANKS, despite the obvious talent they had. An invite league shouldnt invite a brand new team, specifically one everyone knew would have problems scheduling matches. Im not sore over us getting the boot because of it, we would have had trouble winning a match, and the FUYANKS lineup was impressive, but I know we would have been there for every match, and I know it was pretty obvious scheduling issues would occur. But its not just their fault, at least euros have an excuse as to why matches arent getting scheduled, which is more then some teams over here can say.
Like 20 said, need more than 8 teams in invite.
also, I agree with 37, a main division might be best for next season, group together a general pool of talent and see where that leads for a potential I division for the 3rd season...assuming we arent all customizing our headgear shoulderpads and shirt patches for level ups
#46 we listen to what you have to say but it doesn't always mean we jump and get it done it done right away. We have limited resources and things need be prioritized and while TF2 is important, we also have other things in the pipeline that we need to dedicate time and people to. I don't remember your suggestions off hand, but just because someone suggests something doesn't mean it is in the best interest of the community to do or get done right away.
We all have tons and tons of ideas to improve things, but we simply have to prioritize what is important and I feel very strongly that our product as-is is ready for prime time but there certainly are improvements that can and should be made over time.
</troll>
Lame
Oh well, paying the league fee to play half a season... Won't ever fall for that scam again :).
With that said, ehFk has been incredibly helpful towards us during our stay here in ESEA. Too bad the higher up admins wasn't able to help with a simple task as rescheduling a game. Thank you, ehFk. Enjoy your league fee money, ESEA.
It's a pretty bad strategy to try to appeal to a new competitive community in a fairly new game when you've gained the image of a broken system. One of the things I've heared from ESEA is that they're better for reasons such as their prize pot in comparison to CEVO. However, if there is a flood of issues and complaints dealing with the system at hand despite the fact that the prize pot is exceptionally better, then that tells me there is a conflict of interest when it comes to priorities. That's not a good thing when you're trying to grow.
And although you might see an increase in subscriptions, I don't even have to mention the increase in forfeits, drops, and general whining and complaining. I can't attribute all of those things towards ESEA itself of course, but I'd be more than willing to assume that if things ran a little better than people would be less inclined to submit to those types of things.
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